Student StoryDorit Perry

Non Artist · United States

InterviewTranscript

  • All right, three, two, one. Hey, everybody. Harry Whelchel here today. I've got Dorit Perry. Dorit brought, came on about 30 days ago. And in the last 30 days, she brought on two new clients, all right? So I'm gonna pass it over to you, Dorit. Why don't you introduce yourself and tell everybody a little bit about your business?

  • Sure. Hi, everyone. My name's Dorit Perry. Yes, I've been working with Harry for about 30 days now. And I help teachers and professors move from teaching to tech, to the tech sector.

  • Okay, very cool. So how did you get into that? And do you have a background in teaching yourself?

  • I do. I was a high school English and drama teacher, a public high school English and drama teacher in California when I lived there. And before I got credentialed and moved into the classroom, I worked in education in a ton of capacities and then I left teaching and worked in a number of different capacities. So I haven't been a career teacher and that's, I think that's part of the value that I offer my clients, that I've worked in other industries and lived in a number of different cities. But it's really knowing that the kind of the joys and the real challenges of being a teacher--

  • What--

  • And, yeah--

  • What initially got you into teaching yourself back, way back in the day?

  • That's a good question. You know, I'd done so many things. I pursued acting, I pursued comedy, I was one of these dreamer types and I had trouble making the leap from school, from college to the real world. Like, I always excel so much in school, but getting into the professional realm was always hard and I ended up just going back to school over and over. And I got a master's and I studied acting, in comedy for years and I got my teaching credentials, so I thought I would just like formalize it. And I loved young people, I still do. And I do love, like I'm a lifelong learner, I love the school setting. And who doesn't love the idea of summer break? So I was like, let me try this. But it was a big thing to try. I have to go back to school and get my credential, the program costs money, it's an investment. So another reason I did it is, honestly, I thought that teaching drama would keep me close to my roots in acting and improv and I think that was just a misconception that I had that I had learned the hard way. That it wasn't really the way to do it, at least for me at that time at that school.

  • Got it. Okay, very cool. And so how long have you been helping teachers move to the tech sector?

  • Moved to the tech sector officially about 30 days, but I have been working with teachers to transition to different roles and industries. It'll be two years this fall.

  • Okay, very cool, very cool. And so as you've done this over the last two years, what do you think makes you unique about how you can help teachers transition to a new career?

  • I think it's, again, part of what I mentioned, having done it myself so many times, it's sort of transition in this make over and starting over but it's still leveraging all the experience that I've come with, I think having done it and having really, I really empathize with the challenges of teaching. There are teachers and places and leaders in education that are wonderful and there are also a lot of teachers that are unhappy and wanna make a change but don't know how. So I think that my combination of both being in the classroom and working in the tech sector myself and, again, just working in different industries and in different cities really makes me unique. I've also been doing it successfully for some time for, I've been doing it, I've been doing it, right, I've been doing it and I was teaching. So I've come up with what I had sort of a program model for a while. I was working one-to-one with people in like a nine-week coaching program, and then I moved to group coaching, and then I actually had some challenges with that, and now I'm back to the one-to-one with a more specific teaching to tech focus.

  • Got it. Okay, very cool, very cool. And so you mentioned a minute ago like that you've also, not only were you a teacher, but you also have transitioned from teaching and you had some roles, worked in tech yourself after teaching. Can you tell me a little bit more about that? What sort of role did you have in tech?

  • I was in content marketing by blogging, social media, I worked on partnerships with other clients and marketers around the country who complimented the service that my company offered. We offered a software as a service for helping companies to run more efficient meetings and eliminate unnecessary meetings. I think now with the remote work and pandemic, this is on everybody's minds. Like, do we need this meeting, can we do it remotely, all of this, but we were doing that a number of years ago.

  • Very cool. What were some of the good things about that role?

  • I got to be reading and writing all the time, which I love doing both things, part of that lifelong learning. I got to research and write and learn from super smart people in my company who also had different backgrounds. And it was a small kind of tight team. I just got to learn a lot, which is great. And I really got a sense of how teachers are a fit for moving into the tech sector, but they just might not know it or have preconceived notions about what the tech sector means or maybe not be fully aware of what the roles are that they can do.

  • Yeah, it's so interesting, right, like how we get, we get in like, like view ourselves in a certain way and maybe we don't see how, what we do and what our skills are could translate elsewhere. What are some ways like teachers are uniquely a good fit for corporate life, for tech life? Can you speak to some of that?

  • Sure, teachers are very fast learners. Teachers are improvisers, which is another reason that I was drawn to it. There's a lot of improvising that has to happen all the time because you're in a classroom with 30 people, say, pre-pandemic, 30 bodies, a limited of time and objective to reach, and it's just, what teachers go through, I think unless people are in the classroom, it's really hard to understand and conceive because it's that scenario all day long, five days a week, every month for an academic school year. So they're very flexible. They're very, they're able to adapt. They're able to change plans on a moment's notice, even the shift with the pandemic from in-person to virtual teaching is an example of that. They're incredibly emphatic, which is appearing quite a bit in the literature these days about how to be an effective leader in the tech and corporate worlds. They know how to establish strong connections. They know how to identify problems and solve them. I think that teachers are really excellent problem solvers. Again, they're solving problems all day long, every second. And they're willing and they're smart and able to learn. And it just might be for them a matter of not knowing how to make that leap or even that they might want to, so I opened up that door for them, that possibility for them.

  • I love it and I think, we haven't talked about this, but just hearing you say that, this comes to mind like, if you would think about it, a teacher has 30 students, right, so almost like in a tech language, it's like they're, they have 30 direct reports, 30 people they're managing, right?

  • Right.

  • And a manager in the actual tech world would like, I don't, I can't think of anybody who would think that having 30 direct reports is a good idea. So if some, if a teacher can manage 30 people and then they go and they become a manager in tech and they manage five people or seven people or something like that, it's gotta be like I'll cakewalk.

  • I think it is. But I think that one of the obstacles for teachers making this transition, say, into a managerial role directly is that I think there's a perception that managing young people is not the same as managing adults. So when I work with my clients, we, I do, we do talk about any times that they've trained or managed their adult staff. But I think it's an arbitrary distinction, though. I don't think there's a big difference between managing young people and managing older people. I think, physically, the people might look older than they are, but we're all, honestly, we're all just kids, right? You can just look in and see the kids. And so maybe the behavior with adults isn't as outwardly visible that any kind of resistance or not wanting to do something, but it's expressed in different ways. Maybe they're texting all the time in a meeting and not paying attention or maybe they're chafing against some kind of company directive or whatever it is, so that same resistance happens in both. And also, it's not just obviously working with resistance when you're managing people, it's also helping to grow them into their potential, which is exactly what teachers do. So having a trajectory of growth in mind for the person and being able to honestly and sensitively convey feedback is something teachers do all the time.

  • Yeah, yeah, no, I think you nailed it. Like the technical work of what a high school student or even middle school, elementary school student is different, but the emotional behavioral issues are probably really similar. And I bet like teachers are just gonna be like off the charts when it comes to like emotional behavioral issues and really having a nose for that. 'Cause a lot of times you get these like technical people that get promoted to engineers, sorry, managers for the first time and they just don't have that emotional muscle built. So they can't even like pick up and sense when people are upset, frustrated, they don't feel like they're growing, whatever it might be. So anyway, like food for thought, I just think that there's some, you're right. Lie it might be hard for them to go translate, transfer directly into a manager role. But once they're in that seat, I think they can do really, really good things with their background.

  • And there's definitely a difference between being great at your craft and being able to manage others to be great at their craft. And I think that part of the problem is tech companies and other, not just tech, but they'll conflate expertise at a role would being able to manage and those are really two separate skills. Some people do have both, of course, but they're honestly two separate, two separate skills. So teachers will walk in knowing how to manage people.

  • Yep, I love it. So let's switch gears for a second. Let's go back to before we were working together. What were you doing at the time?

  • I was all of a sudden building out my group at training programs. So I was creating, I had that nine-week, eight-week one-to-one coaching program and I was creating video modules for each week and I was trying to attract clients to the course.

  • Okay, and how is that going?

  • Everything going great much to my chagrin. I really started actively trying to add people to my group programming in the New Year, so January 2020, and for some reason I was having much more trouble in converting them to one-to-one and I didn't know why. And I really didn't know why. So I was building it out, I was building out these videos, and somehow I had this idea that once the videos were built, it was just gonna be cake for me. Like, yes, of course I have my group Q&As, but the videos would do sort of all the heavy lifting that I had been doing in the one-to-one arena. But I wasn't converting people. Not only was I not converting people, I was just having trouble attracting people to talk to me. And so let's say that the pandemic became part of the public consciousness, say, late February, early March and then of course that can affect spending and everything. But it was even prior to that, that I was having trouble converting. And I was just really confused and frustrated. I knew I had a really good product, albeit general, and I needed help. I was really stuck actually.

  • Do you feel like, did you, at the time, kinda, were you clear that that problem you weren't be able to get in touch, be able to talk to them, you weren't bringing in clients, was that like something that you were registering or were you really just focused on the program? Like, was the program kinda like, well, I can't get in touch with people, so I'm just gonna work on the program and that at least I'm moving something forward? Like, what was your thought process at the time?

  • That was happening. I really, really was invested in finishing this program. And actually I would have spoken to you earlier, had it not been for my investment in this program. We spoke when I was about three-fourths done with it. So I was registering it, but I was a little bit in denial. And I somehow thought that if I could just finish the program, then I'd be able to turn my full attention to the marketing aspect and I'd be able to solve that problem.

  • Got it, so what, yeah, like were you, when you were going through this, were you kind of like, were you frustrated at all that you weren't getting clients while working on the program or were you just like, no, no, no, it's gonna all work out after, as soon as I finish this?

  • I was definitely frustrated. I did have a few clients, but nothing near what I had imagined to be the case. So I was definitely frustrated. But again, I really thought, okay, let me just finish the course and then I'll focus fully on marketing and it'll be fine.

  • Got it. So what triggered you to like start reaching out or like look for something? Why do you think, what was going around in your mind? There must have been some part of you that was like, oh, maybe I should be working on marketing or working on sales, for you to reach out to me. Do you remember what was, was there something that triggered that or what happened?

  • With me reaching out to you?

  • Mm-hmm.

  • Yeah, you, let's see, so at one point, maybe five weeks before I scheduled a quick chat with you, I had been having trouble with my video software. Like, I couldn't figure out something basic. We're in a private Facebook group together, so I put a post saying, can anyone help me with this question. And you actually sent me a message and said, I'll be happy to hop on a call with you and help you with this. And I was pretty blown away by that. I was so grateful and I was like, oh my God, this is incredible. Why is this happening? So I didn't end up needing to get on the call with you, you actually just kinda coached me through it in the message. And then, say, maybe four or five weeks after that, you put a, I saw a post of yours that said, hey, I'm filling up with clients, if you wanna work with me or talk to me, do so now. So then immediately I did it. I've been kinda following your posts and really watching some of your testimonials and it just felt like all of a sudden I needed to talk to you.

  • Awesome, and so what do you think, in those early days, piqued your interest?

  • I really liked the responses you were giving people. They always seemed measured and fair and thoughtful. You seemed like a really nice person, somebody who be easy to talk to. And you seem to have a broad, like a breadth of knowledge in a lot of subjects. So you had the technical piece, which sometimes I had challenges with, but you're also, you seem to have the, you seem to have the heart piece as well, right? So both the craft and both the people skills.

  • Awesome.

  • And I wanted to talk to you and see what you had to say.

  • So let's go back to that. So we spoke a couple times, what were some kind of like, I don't know, yeah, what were some, I feel like there were certain things that you had, yeah, in your mind that you thought needed to happen and I started kind of questioning that, probing that, and what were some aha moments you had in some of the early conversations we had?

  • Well, one of the aha moments was that I needed to connect with teachers who were on a more urgent path to lead the classroom prior to working with you. And certainly to that conversation, I had been casting a very wide net. Are you thinking of leaving teaching? Might you wanna leave teaching in the next couple of years? Might you be retiring? Like I had all these really long fishnets that I was throwing out. And so the people I was talking to and that were coming to me, some of them are urgent, there were a few who had resigned and needed to get to work and get a job right away. But a lot of them weren't, and I didn't really identify that issue before we spoke and had a strategy session. So that was a huge aha moment. And even identifying teachers who might be in other science teachers or hold leadership roles. The truth is actually have some English teachers who are gonna be fabulous in the tech room. You don't need to be math or science. I have some people I'm working with that are just incredibly skills across the board. But I hadn't thought about it from that perspective. And it really, yeah, it was such a great learning and I definitely remember having it during the call. It happened in real time.

  • Yeah, I feel like--

  • So that was it.

  • We talked a lot about, correct me if I'm wrong. It was like just realizing that within teachers, there's a bunch of different types of teachers, different groups of teachers that are easier to work with, harder to work with, and then like what, where they wanna go, like, rather than just transition out of teaching on some indefinite timetable, like how can we make that more specific, crisp or more concrete? And did you have any resistance, any of these ideas at first?

  • Well, the one idea I had major, well, I had resistance to a couple of ideas and it really took me about a week into our program to really get on the same page with you, which surprised me 'cause I always thought I had a flexible ego. But in this particular example, it was kind of rigid. I had to really work through it. So I did have some resistance to the teaching to tech path because before it had been, I just helped teachers transition. And I was kind of proud of my generalist status, I had compiled this massive list of everything they could do and they always were very positive in general when we got to that point in the program, but also I could sense that a lot of them were quite overwhelmed by it. So narrowing down like that really was something I had to work with. Like, I knew it was good, but I had to arrive to it on my own time.

  • You could intellectually be like, okay, I see what you're saying, but you had to like internalize it yourself and digest it and like get there for your own situation. And that took some day, a couple of days at least.

  • That did. I would say, that took definitely five to seven days of me like crouched in the corner with my head in my hands, trying to like come to terms with what you were suggesting 'cause I had a lot of pride around my previous offer, and I know I had helped people. But you were suggesting, do we get more specific? And you even suggested these changes to my program that I, at first, caved against. Like, now that now that I'm working with people and kind of following our new model, I'm seeing that we cut out so much fluff that I actually didn't think was fluff. So another thing that I had a lot of resistance against, and really it took me about a week to come to terms with, was you said that I should let the video stop, I should stop. And I said, what are you talking about? All I have is a couple more. Do you know I have dedicated my life to this for months? And I'm almost there and you're telling me to stop and that was a real tough one for me. That was a really hard one for me.

  • That was probably like the hardest one, I think, looking back.

  • Yeah, yes, exactly. That was harder for me than the teaching to tech that I had to come to terms with. And it was like I had been on this course and I thought I was sailing in the right direction, although I had some concerns, and you came and said, you really need to point your boat in a different direction. And I was like, no, but the sun's over there. You said, no, it's actually over there.

  • Well, do you think that like it wasn't, like at the time, in the moment, you probably thought, oh my God, Harry is, I'm doing, trying to go this way and Harry's making me go that way. But now, like looking back on it, like would you agree that it was really just like a minor tweak? Like it's much less of a big deal than you think in the moment?

  • Yes, yes, 100%. But at the time, it seemed massive.

  • Huge, like it's the most weighty decision that you could make.

  • Absolutely. Because I had been telling myself this story that like once my videos are done, all will be well in the world. Kind of like, that's it, I can sail on free into the sunset. And I do hope to get back to the videos at some point. But when I really--

  • You will.

  • Kind of nailed this path that I'm now on, right.

  • I think this is good, 'cause there's a lot of people out there that, yeah, they think like the secret, there's some secret sauce. If they make some PowerPoint slides and record themselves talking over them, that they're gonna have a big business. And it's like, why is that, not necessarily the case, in your opinion?

  • I think it might be a story that the people who are selling the courses want us to believe. And of course, there are people who make it happen. But we don't really know how they got there, or how long it took them, or what their offer is, or what their challenges have been. I mean, I know there are a lot of successful online businesses, but maybe it's better to, not online businesses, online coaching perks, but maybe the key to doing that is to first get your offer and your messaging really, really tight with no fluff, no extras and then do that.

  • Yeah, that's it. That's what I was, it's like it's all about what are you teaching, right, the content, and is it exactly what they need to get where they wanna go? And it just happens to be that like, videos are great, scalable way to deliver that, but if you don't know that what you're delivering is right, it's better to work, potentially work with people closely as you figured that out and discover it and validate your offer, as you said. Does that make sense?

  • Yeah, it does.

  • So, okay, so this is great. So we got started working together, and so the first thing we did is like look through your offer, audit it, get clear on that. Anything else to add there on that process?

  • In terms of, we can talk about the action plan also. But the offer... I'm now, let's see, with the offer, too we mentioned money in my offer, right? Like moving into, from teaching to tech without going back to school and making six figures. So that was also something we had to work on, this idea of, can I really say that, and how to think about that offer. So that took some work together on.

  • Yeah, and so we got clear on the offer and then what did we do next? Do you remember what we did after that?

  • We did the action plan, sort of the five steps they need to take, to to hit. And we made it very quantifiable, which when I share with potential clients on strategy sessions, they love it, and they say how chunkable it is and that they, that it's achievable. And I remember having the same reaction when we were initially talking about working together and I was like, I love that he's broken it down into goals for me. So it was just great to hear that reflected back from people I'm speaking to. It just makes a very big goal more chunked down and more achievable. And it's what teachers do all the time actually. They have to chunk everything down into bite-sized lessons and then built from there. So it makes a lot of sense, but somehow applying it to myself and my own business was hard. I needed another person to help guide me to do that.

  • Awesome, so we did that. And then we, if I recall, we updated your message on social media. Can you share a little bit about, like what happened when you changed your message and what sort of reaction you got?

  • That was amazing. Within a day, I had 30 comments from people who wanted to talk to me, people who I friended on Facebook and I knew were teachers but I had never been able to get them on a call before. All of a sudden it's like everyone came out of the woodwork and wanted to talk to me. And I had all these strategy sessions, and out of that just, out of that one post on Facebook, I got two new clients. I've already been working with them for a week now. They're very happy. And it was just amazing. It just felt like, wow, I just make a post and they come running. It's amazing.

  • Yeah, why do you think that that post resonated more with people you were friends with that you've maybe been friends with for months than the stuff you've done in the past?

  • Well, I think part of your coaching has to do around like what is it that people really want underneath it all? What do they really want, whether or not they know it or say it? And one of those things is financial, I don't wanna say freedom, but financial mobility or financial comfort.

  • Security.

  • What's that, security, exactly. So I think mentioning that six, the six figures, really spoke to the heart of a lot of teachers who are working their butts off and making substandard wages for many years and maybe they have master's degrees and tons of professional development, but there's still, because that's the way it's set up in our society. They're not being compensated well. And they know they have a lot to offer, they know they're doing important work, and they maybe can't pay the gas bill. So that's a problem, right? So that really spoke to them. I think that was it. Another piece of it was the not going back to school. A lot of people I work with are overeducated, they're not undereducated, at least in the traditional sense of bachelor's, master's, all of this. So I think that there was a perception or it's a perception amongst teachers that they have to go back, in addition to their master's in education, now they have to go get a master's in something else, and they don't wanna, there's still maybe paying off that, the first loans and struggling to make ends meet. So this idea that the message hints out, which is that non, which is that traditional schooling, isn't always the way I think really spoke to them.

  • Got it.

  • And I think a lot of them, oh, so go ahead.

  • No, you go ahead.

  • Oh, just, they're into tech a lot of them. They're using tech in their classrooms, they're getting, they've had to make that switch, that immediate overnight pivot with the pandemic. They see that it's all online and they know that there's burgeoning tech industries in the education field, in the healthcare field and they're excited about the possibility of being able to grow too and move in a different direction, which is something that society doesn't really allow teachers the same way it does people in really any other profession I would say. Maybe lawyers are kind of stuck too. But yeah, society is like, there's this idea that teaching is appalling and certainly it could be for some people, but that's not always the case. And why shouldn't teachers be able to make a change without having the wrap of society come down on them, right, so to speak. I'm speaking in kind of extremes, but just trying to make a point here.

  • Absolutely, absolutely. So what do you think, you had about 30 people comment on that post, did anything change in your outreach to those people, how you communicate with them, how you got some of them on strategy sessions, what was that process like going from comments to strategy sessions?

  • Sure, yeah, that totally changed working with you. I had been immediately jumping to strategy sessions with people in the past. And sometimes I could convert them and many times I couldn't, right?

  • Why do you think you were doing that that way?

  • I don't know. Maybe it's like me looking for the fastest, most immediate, most direct way. I like to think I'm a direct person. What's that?

  • Trying to save time.

  • Maybe that's what it was. Absolutely.

  • Be more efficient.

  • Yeah, in the name of efficiency. But efficiency isn't the best way to create human relationship and nurture people's growth and convert. I don't think that it's the best way. A lot of my conversions have been through some kind of referral. That's really how a lot of them have worked.

  • Beforehand.

  • What's that?

  • Beforehand, right?

  • Yeah, beforehand, right. So now, through coaching with you, I don't ask for a strategy session right away. We chat, I try to get to know what's going on with them, I try to add some value. From there, we would go to just a quick chat and then to a strategy session. So it's a longer sales process, but it's amazing to feel the relationship warm up and to have, like getting on a, getting on a strategy session with the person who's primed to buy is a very different experience than just trying to save time and get someone on right away. It's a totally different experience. I can feel that we have a strong connection at the very beginning of the call. That makes all the difference for them and for me in my own confidence.

  • That's amazing. So, yeah, how has the character and the tone of your recent strategy sessions changed?

  • It's slower. It's slower, but more about them and their questions. So in the past, I might've rushed to blurt out everything I do when I sort of got to my time to talk about what I do. But now, it's very much a conversation. Like this, it's very much a question and answer. I wanna address any possible concerns throughout the call versus at the end. It's just more, it's less like a monologue and much more on conversation.

  • Yep. So take you back to the strategy sessions that you had with the clients came on. What was like asking for the sale like at the end? Was it easier where there's less friction? Like, was it, were you less nervous? Tell me more about that.

  • So working with you is what you're asking, right?

  • The last two strategy sessions that you brought up, the two new clients, yep.

  • Oh yeah. Let's see, so it just was like a very logical end to the conversation. It all just flowed really well. And I painted a very, I painted a thorough picture of what we would do and what they would be getting and all of the pieces of the program and how I would support them and it's like the natural conclusion to then state the price. So it just feels like a more seamless, it feels like a much more personal sales process this way. And I still had success in the prior way, but it's different now. I'm coming in much more confident and they're coming in much more warm.

  • Yeah, and it sounds like, I like the way you describe it. It's not like there's this jarring moment where you get into the close. It's just like an organic progression of the conversation.

  • Exactly, exactly.

  • So take me back to, like, I think it was a Friday, it would be last Friday, and both clients agreed to sign up and pay on that same day. What was that like for you?

  • Within like 30 minutes of each other, I was like, what's happening? That was incredible. That was amazing. So one client I had a sort of quick check-in call with her the day after the strategy session. She wanted to think about it a little bit. I said, great, let's connect tomorrow at this time. And I didn't know what she would say, I was actually thinking she might say no, but she said yes. And I was like, great. And I sent her the invoice on the call, she paid, and we started three days later on that Monday. And the other client had given me a verbal yes maybe five days before that, but I had trouble with the technical piece of sending her the invoice and then I felt bad for keeping her on the phone, so I didn't handle, that didn't go off as well as I would've liked. And I didn't know if she'd come back. I just didn't know. I wanted to believe it, but until a client pays they're not actually a client, right? So she just, I actually just quickly followed up with her after I signed this other client and said, if you'd like to move forward one day, let's kinda take care of, please stay here at the invoice today, and she wrote back immediately and paid immediately. And I was like, wow, this is awesome. It started with both of them that next week. And we're moving through things. It's great.

  • How did it feel that day to just have both those come through? And I think it had been maybe a little while since you'd brought on a client, right?

  • Yeah, it'd been a couple months since I brought on maybe two people. And prior to that, it'd been a couple months. So it was like these long gaps. It felt great. It felt like, honestly, part of it was like, could it really be this easy? But it's only easy when you know the formula or the recipe for it.

  • Or have the foundations in place. It shows like, sorry to cut you off, but like the, it's almost like a force multiplier if you have the basics really well done. You know what I mean?

  • Mm-hmm, exactly. I have to do less work as a salesperson when my offer is super strong and really speaks to their deepest desires. And it's specific, even more specific. I thought my offer was specific before. I thought it was specific and that it was teachers who wanted to leave, but I think I, when I think about the wording and kind of obsessing over the wording of that prior offer, I think I chose the word transition deliberately because it was kind of vague and I wasn't sure how it would play out. But it turns out that if you refine your messaging, then it can cloud in a different way, in a better way.

  • Yep, yep. Do you think any of that, like wanting to keep it wider was like maybe just wanting to, not necessarily be on the hook for getting them a really tangible outcome, do you think any part of it was that?

  • Yeah, I think I didn't want to fall asleep, present myself as like a recruiter or a person who places people. If anything, I think I have a tendency to undersell myself out of humility and just, I'd rather overdeliver and understate, but I'm learning from you that's maybe not the best way to go about it in terms of understating.

  • It's a balance. But I think, yeah, I think a lot of people struggle with this. I used to struggle with it. But you figure out, I think one of the things we talked about was like, as long as you know it's possible, then you're breaking things down and you're setting expectations at the right points in the process, then having a more specific, attractive claim is great because it picks, not only it like attracts a different type of person, it attracts that like ambitious person, that motivated person. So like actually that's, this is a good segue. Tell me a little bit about what it's been like to work with those two new clients, like what has, have they been qualitatively different than maybe some of your other clients in the past?

  • They're similar to my most ambitious clients in the past and my clients with the most immediate needs in the past, which is really the kind of client I'd like to work with moving forward 'cause then I can help them make that change. And it doesn't have to be, it doesn't have to be just, that they know the process and have gained confidence, but actually they're getting tangible results. So getting interviews, they're getting offers, their Fortune connections are doing it faster than sort of the traditional job, way you suggest that it'll be.

  • Is it easy to work with them?

  • Say it again.

  • Is it easy to work with them?

  • Yeah, it is. We just get down to work, it's awesome. It's easy to work with them. They're both very open to what I have to suggest. We're really in the moment and like looking to the future versus kind of regretting the past, which is really what I'd like to have in my clients, uniformly moving forward.

  • Awesome, so if you have to summarize, what sort of results have you seen working with me?

  • With you, okay. Everything, everything. I was seeing results in everything. Like, I know better how to spend my time. In the past, I used to spread myself thin over different social media platforms. And now, I'm much more specific. Like, I have my priorities straight, I have better language for sales calls, I have a way to talk about the future of my potential clients that's more specific and more tangible than what I used to, what I used to say. It used to be like, well, we're gonna discover what you wanna do. And it would take us the first struck of the program to do that. And now we can just get right in to the--

  • You're doing that on the sales call now, right? And so by the time you--

  • Mm-hmm, right, yeah. Basically within my offers embedded obviously, this idea that we're moving into the tech sector. Now, what that looks like, it has a lot of flexibility. But we know that it's the tech sector and we know that the tech sector has opportunities and we know that a lot of people wanna continue working remotely, so it provides the opportunity for all those things. Yes, so did that answer your question? I might need it again actually, oh, working with you, let's see.

  • What sort of results have you seen? Yeah.

  • Yeah, I really liked the community you've created. I feel really supported. I feel like it's manageable size. I don't feel like I disappear in it, which is really important to me. I've discovered and actually know that before joining your community. So I know how to ask for help when I need it, I know the language to use, I know, like it's just been night and day from my experience before working with you. I do wish I had started working with you sooner. I wish that. So just like on those videos, I wish I had.

  • What do you think your ROI has been working with us?

  • Well, financially, I've definitely made back my investment from that 30 days. But I think, qualitatively, like the confidence and the enthusiasm and the strategies I now have, that's, you can't really put a price on that for somebody who's trying to grow a business.

  • Yeah, it's an amazing to see like you change in the last 30 days. Like, you've knocked through like massive limiting beliefs in like a really good way where it's like all the stuff that you've learned in the last 30 days, it's like you're gonna take with you and carry for the rest of your life. So it's so cool to work with people like you who just level up so quickly. You know what I mean?

  • Yeah, I was in a pretty negative space when I came to you. I was kind of like, I had the idea, like if this guy can't help me, I'm out. Like, I gotta do something else. I can't keep doing this, because I can't sustain a life like this. So I had a lot, I had a lot, I haven't really, I mean, I'm a big believer in risk-taking, but calculated, measured risk-taking. You do your homework and then you make a decision. But yeah, it's been very different, everything. My mindset, how I think about things. So you've made a tremendous impact in my life in a very short time, and that's an incredible thing to be able to do. So thank you for it.

  • No worries, no worries. So why do you think, like going back to when we had that, our sales call, like why did you decide to do business with me?

  • I like to work with people who are smarter than me or know things more than I do 'cause I know that's where my learning can happen. I knew I had a lot to learn from you. I already learned so much in just our two short conversations. You really challenged me. And if you didn't challenge me, I would be worried because I needed someone to challenge me. You're, like I mentioned, just, I think you're very thoughtful, which is really important to me, and you're also kind and nice. And so I had obviously watched some of your case studies, I saw previous clients that were really positive about the work you've done and I really had come to accept that I needed additional support. Like I wanted to be able to do it kinda on my own and I really tried for a long time, but I just, I figured out I needed more support and I needed to work with somebody who I felt aligned with and that person turned out to be you.

  • So do you think, like, what kicked you over the fence, so to speak on the sales call?

  • On the sales call. You're excellent closing skills. I feel like, you just kinda helped me to the fire, and said, Dorit, do you wanna make this change? Do you think I can help you? I can help you. What's stopping you? It was that kind of like heated moment at the end where I just jumped all in. So it was partly me, but it was partly you. I feel like that was probably the best close I had ever experienced. And I was kind of dealing with some of my ego resistance around some of your suggestions, so that was a little bit where my head was. So you just skillfully navigated me to it. And again, it was kind of like an all, for me, I knew that if I couldn't fix it, I would have to do something else. So I didn't have, honestly, that much to lose either.

  • Well, it was, I mean, on my side, like it wasn't an easy sale. Like, I had to nudge you a lot to get you to say yes. And I'm thankful that I did. But I think it was like on the edge of a knife, like I was nervous that you just weren't seeing what I was trying to convey. And it's just so interesting. It shows, like I think you knew intellectually that I was right, but you were just having so much resistance 'cause you had invested so much psychologically in your current course. And I think at some point, I said, like, Dorit, at the end of the day, like, do you trust me? And you were like, yes. And I think that's when the close happened and we moved forward basically.

  • Agree. And there's something very personal about that, right? Like, person to person, do you trust me? Do you think I can help you? And I did. And so if that's the answer, then it's clear that the next step is to move on.

  • So would you recommend others work with me?

  • Absolutely, 100%, hands down, yes.

  • Why is that?

  • I just think you've got the whole game. Like, you really have a great handle on it, on all pieces of it. And that's hard, to find someone who's so well-sealed across the board. You work with people in a variety of industries. It seems like there's no, your foundational principles that you've put together and language to talk about them really, it seems like they applied it to anything. So for someone who's eager, someone who's stuck in any aspect of their business, I think could benefit from working with you and from, you're like a really good auto mechanic. You kinda go in, you look at the parts, and you say, this is actually screwed on in the wrong place, we should put this here, and the engine needs to be fixed before the carburetor. I know nothing about cars. But yeah, you're very accessible and you're very clear. As a former language teacher, like clarity is very important to me. And being thoughtful and intelligent. So you kind of met all my criteria there. I wanted someone who could really challenge me and know things more than me. So I like to think that I'm a tough person to please when it comes to finding coaches, and I've had some extraordinary coaches in my life, like I consider you one of them, but you're really, you're just like that mechanic or that doctor that says, this is where the system is broken and here's how I suggest we fix it. Here's how we can fix it. Yeah, it's really not, if someone's having trouble, they should work with you. That's how I see it.

  • Yep, it's like what we're doing with growing these businesses, it's not rocket science, but it is a complex recipe. And it's important to do like the right things in the right order and place the appropriate amount of emphasis on different things. And so there's something, too like, have you ever heard of the idea of like simplicity on the other side of complexity? Have you ever heard of that?

  • Things like it. But tell me more.

  • Well, just like the idea of like, yes, you have to kind of work with somebody who understood all the complexities, like weighed the pros and cons, know what works, gone down the rabbit holes, fallen in the sand traps so that they have the simplicity on the other side of that and they can just cut through it and bring you clarity much faster because they've been a couple of steps ahead of you, if that makes sense.

  • Yeah, definitely.

  • So who do you think we're especially a good fit for?

  • Gosh, again, I think your knowledge applies to people in different industries, working with different problems. I think you're a great fit for people who are ready to learn what they're, what they may be doing wrong and who are ready to try to fix it. So people with, yeah, people with kind of great learning attitude. Similar to being a teacher, you wanna find students who will be responsive to you and be open-minded and wrestle with what you're saying. So any coach or consultant who is solving a problem for others but they're having problems in their own business, getting various pieces to work, I think, I think B2B stuff, too. I definitely think you could work with big businesses who are, or medium size, whatever who are having problems, 100%. It's all the same complex recipe, if you will.

  • Well, it makes me think of, I think of like your situation, like, I mean, you had helped, what, over 30 teachers in the last two years. You had made sales. But nothing was predictable and nothing was just really clicking, like you didn't have that, whoa, okay, like this is the right thing, like I could see myself keep doing this. You were almost, you were at the end of your rope. You're like, I don't know if I should keep doing this. And I think for people like that who have made some sales but it's just not predictable, they're not at that 5K a month at 10K a month.

  • Right.

  • What do you think about that, that type of consultant or coach?

  • Definitely. When you said to me, I think, again, it was in one of our first calls, like, Dorit, your offer, you don't have a predictable source of leads. I was like, oh my God, he's right. And you even said something like, your offer isn't strong enough. So I didn't even realize, like I knew intellectually, yeah, that my problem was, I don't know if it's intellectually, like I knew that I had times when I had customers and times when I didn't, but the idea of making the machine work in a more predictable manner or getting that to be my reality, no, not the case. So now in that direction, thank God.

  • So why should someone who's listening take action right now?

  • Well, time is of the essence. Things are changing at a massive, rapid pace in our world. They were even before Black Lives Matter and before the pandemic, right? Now it's just, it seems like everything's accelerated and everything's also slowed down. Why should people take action? Well, if they, why shouldn't, because if they wanna, I mean, I don't really know how to answer this. Like, if they'd want to--

  • Well, if they're on the fence about working with me, why should they take action right now?

  • Because I'm confident you can help them. It's not, I think you're becoming more and more, more of a known quantity. And the sooner people can solve like the backups in their system and their business, the better for them and the better for their clients. There's really no reason to wait, I don't think. I wish I had acted sooner.

  • Cool.

  • I hope that answers the question.

  • It does, no, it's perfect. So what's your number one piece of advice for coaches and consultants right now?

  • In general. Is it in general?

  • Yeah, in general.

  • I guess to ask themselves if they drill down to the essence of the problem and cut away the fluff and really like kinda look at that deep, naked human desire of what people want, basically what all of us want for the most part, and if they're addressing that.

  • Awesome.

  • And if it's not doing that, how can they make it do that more?

  • That makes sense. I dig it, I like it. So, Dorit, this has been fantastic. Thank you so much for your time. If people wanna learn more about you and like your business, how can they find out more about you online?

  • Sure, they can find me at my sparsely, my sparse website doritperry.com. I'm on Facebook, which is where I do a lot of my marketing. And they can email me at info@doritperry.com.

  • Amazing. Awesome.

  • Yeah.

  • Well, thanks so much. We'll talk soon, okay?

  • Sounds good, thank you, Harry. Goodbye, everyone.

  • Bye.

  • Bye.

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